Replacing h2o bottle bosses seems easy…until you accidentally split a frame legnthwise. Tune in to this #carbonqueries for our take on how to safely replace these bosses.
Dan: 00:01 Today’s inquiry comes from our friend Jeff. Jeff is saying, I’ve replaced these water bottle bosses in alloy frames numerous times, but never on carbon. What is the best tool solution for the job?
Shawn: 00:16 depends on the frame, does depend on the frame. Every carbon bikes design differently with how they handle water bottle bosses. Some are bonded to a carbon washer and then glued to the frame. So I guess the question is, if you’re replacing it, one of them broke. Um, this one was a serve [inaudible] if that changes anything. Yeah, those are just popper or they’re just a riv nuts. So at that point you need to remove the old one, which is actually one of the harder aspects because you know, everybody knows you can just drill it out, look at it, the correct drill charts to pick your drill bit. Don’t drill too big because you’re going to put too big of a hole in the frame. So yet again, try and drill it and it’s going to spin. You can’t drill a spinning objects. So that is honestly one of the hardest things. We struggle with that as well. We have a couple tricks that’s kind of, I don’t know, case by case and then the shop, but if it’s easier to drill one out, good. If a riv nut that is just spinning in a frame and the threads are fine, where you can recall you can compress it and then actually just lock it in more and that’s the. Does Park make a tool? I don’t think park makes one but you can buy them a go to mcmaster-carr and basically all it is is there’s a couple of different options that are super expensive pneumatic ones but the basic one that I love and then we use is you just need two wrenches and it’s got to as you put the riv nut in loaded on a M5 hand you basically spin apart this carriage assembly and it just compresses that way.
Shawn: 01:41 Reason why I like that one, it’s great to get inside of a small triangle of a frame. Downside of that one. You can break a bike. I’ve done it on an older. Where you around when I was setting a rib nut inside of a super aero tube on an older, Quintana Roo or something? I don’t think I was, but can I guess what happened? I split the two. Did he goes right up the seam? Uh, it was small but basically
Dan: 02:08 because that’s what I can see happening is, you know, the, the construction, the same goes in the exact same direction as the direction of the bike is compressed to hard and just split it. Yeah.
Shawn: 02:18 I’m just barely but enough that we were to go back in and repair it, which is not fun with a smaller repair. That’s what you stand. The risk of. You compress too hard. You don’t know what’s on the inside of that bike. It shouldn’t be a perfectly clean flat, smooth area. Shouldn’t be two boats. Boy, depends on the bike. Is there any. I wandered off to have bonding prep. We put a proxy in with ours as well as bond gap filler. Yet again of that riv nut doesn’t perfectly compressed for who knows, whatever reason are a proxy in there is going to act as a secondary gap filler and it’s also you had again, surface area. It’s going to add a little bonding strength, easy way to make it’s easy way to make a big mess. Also, most riv nut inserts or aluminum going to directly placed at carbon. You stand the risk of galvanic corrosion, so the epoxy that you can act as an insulator, they’re not hard to replace. There’s a lot of just best practices and certain scenarios where yeah, bike shop could easily replace a riv nut, not it’s not that hard.
Shawn: 03:15 If you’ve done an aluminum frame, carbon bikes not incredibly different. It’s just you’re working with, you know, seven to eight layers of fiber as material versus, you know, a block of aluminum processes similar yet more involved and there’s more to take into account as you brought up a second ago, our least favorites slash most hilarious problem on certain bikes where the tubes are closed at the end, you drill it out, you’re left with something inside the bike and you now created a rattle right? You can’t get out. We love those.. You’re drilling out a pop rivet on a cable stopping, you’re gonna replace it. And like a seat stay or a chainstay. Oh, you know, just made a sweet little rattle. Shake that bike back around. You can try it all day long and it’s, it’s just bigger than the, than the hole and drill the hole bigger.
Shawn: 04:02 So what are you going to do if no, I have no idea. Our secrets. I guess we can’t give away everything. Anti-Rattle technology. That’s one of the things we play in here. It’s just hard. I mean, there’s just so many case by case scenarios of like, you know, certain frames that are bonded and differently. Some failed differently, some get stuck in the frame, some don’t drill out a. If you are going to drill it out, put a big tape wad on your drill bit. This is a common drilling tip. Most people when you’re drilling through something a that generates heat, which is bad. Go slow. Take your time. Machine slowly use a sharp drill, but sometimes you know when you go through the last little year ever drilled like piece of wood and you go through the other end, all the sudden it free s and it goes straight through. my favorite type of damage that a lot of manufacturing companies or people do and they’re drilling their own bikes is they punch a hole through the backside because the drill goes, oh, they go all the way through either using a long bit, not paying attention and they drill a hole out to the other side or just free s and they’re putting so much weight too because they’re not using a sharp drill bit and then when it frees itself, when you make that hole punches the back side of the frame.
Shawn: 05:07 Oh no happens trick in any sort of. So take your drill, measure your length of your bit that you need to actually drill and not penetrate and just turn the drill slowly. Hold your tape and make a big tape wad on it so that way it acts is just a cheap stopper. There you go. Easy trick for drilling anything pro-tip. Yeah, I mean anytime you need a fairly accurate depth hole, just put a tape wad on it, you know. OK, yeah. You had another solution sticking. Yeah.
Dan: 05:38 Thanks for the good question Jeff. Uh, again, not the most difficult thing to do. If you’ve done it on alloy, you kind of know what to do already. A, just take your time, be careful.
Shawn: 05:50 Do you have questions? Ask us directly, but eventually, yeah, we want to put out so
Dan: 05:55 me more learning channels. How to, how to, for kind of these more repairs that you can do in the shop. We don’t need to do, but thanks for your question. Like I said, if you have any, uh, if you have any further need to, feel free to reach out, happy to guide you in the right direction.
New Speaker: 06:09 And what do you call an aluminum frame with a stuck pop rivet inside a rattle can and we’ll leave it at that.